Racism

[saza]

Hello all! I was wondering how bad is it in Japan? Say if I plan to teach English there and had just graduated from university and want to live there for a long time for work and leisure through a work Visa and sponsorship if I can get one would that be possible? The reason I choose Japan is because Im fascinated by their culture and is very interested in it. (Im still a beginner in terms of their language though)

Im Hong Kong, but I have a permanent Canadian citizenship and have grown up in Canada for the majority of my life. I heard the racism in Japan for Chinese people is really bad. Is this true? For anybody that has lived or is born in Japan, can you guys give me some insight on this issue?


And also, how bad is it in terms of relationships? Do they care if Im Hong Kong? Would I be able to have one? Are they racists or only a small number of them are? Im asking because I prefer Japanese girls and I dont really know so much about the ones that live in Japan so I hope you guys will enlighten me, thanks!

 

[RogerMoore]

As a caucasian it's very difficult for me to answer this but I've found differing opinions among Chinese people who live here. One Taiwanese lady I know loves living in Tokyo and takes any racism as a necessary part of being a foreigner. Others seems to not share this approach and thus close-knit Chinese communities have developed in many areas of Japan, where they look after their own and serve their own needs, I suppose just like they have always done in many countries for many years... nothing wrong with that. Unlike Muslims and other religious zealots, they tend not to annoy other members of the community.

Chinese/Japanese interracial marriage is increasing, so that's an encouraging sign. There is a lot of jealousy among the old guard concerning the emergence of China as an economic force and eclipsing Japan as no. 2 economy in the world. That can't be helped but is counter-balanced by facts like Japan being the largest foreign investor in China.

 

[saza]

Oh, so youre saying its not that bad right? The discrimination only applies to the majority of the old population? Im just guessing that the young people in Japan my age, dont really care?

Ive had varying responses for the Japanese people Ive met, most say they dont care however, there are a few say some Japanese think Chinese people are lame.

 

[RogerMoore]

Oh, so youre saying its not that bad right? The discrimination only applies to the majority of the old population? Im just guessing that the young people in Japan my age, dont really care?

Ive had varying responses for the Japanese people Ive met, most say they dont care however, there are a few say some Japanese think Chinese people are lame.

Yes, young people are not racist at all in my experience.

Chinese lame? I think the Japanese that express that opinion are simply jealous of the current strength of China.

 

[saza]

I mean yeah, it was only one friend and he seems like the type of guy thats like one of those cool kids with attitude thats close to a gangster, but not actually is one thats telling me this. Im not sure what to call that type of person cause hes not your typical polite Japanese.

Most of the Japanese people I met have been extremely polite, I mean yeah everyone is different, I think it is the really hip, young people that would think that..

And dont you see, that it would be bad if they are jealous. It would give them more reason to discriminate the Chinese even more lol.

 

[Pussyhunter1]

i don't know why my last msg has been deleted, anyway:
although many locals really look down gaijin, but as you're Chinese, there shouldn't be any racist problems.

 

[aquamarine]

Regarding racism and those who ARE racist in this country, Chinese would be ranked #1 in the 'dislike' category, quite possibly next to those from the United States. As with your last post, you don't seem to know what you are talking about, hence a probably reason for it's deletion.

 

[saza]

Regarding racism and those who ARE racist in this country, Chinese would be ranked #1 in the 'dislike' category, quite possibly next to those from the United States. As with your last post, you don't seem to know what you are talking about, hence a probably reason for it's deletion.

That sucks dude, how much of a dislike are we talking about here? Like am I at a severe handicap? Or just moderate?

 

[tylersailer]

Racism exists in Japan as much as other countries have. I think Japanese people do not openly/publicly express hatred. In some places you see "NO FOREIGNER WELCOME" signboard still now though.

If you want to teach English, it is quite possible to get the job in Japan, particulary in Tokyo. But You have to be prepared mentally to face racism in school. Kids tend to think English speakers are all white American, not Asian origin. I know one public junior high school in Tokyo rejected one Australian native English teacher to come for teaching because he was Chinese-Australian. I couldn't believe this decision was taken by PUBLIC school in Japan's proudful metropolitan city.

You know there are a lot of guys like you who want to teach English in Japan so competition should be high though. And be sure to speak gramatically correct English.

Welcome to Japan.

 

[guy]

In some places you see "NO FOREIGNER WELCOME" signboard still now though.

Only in Hokkaido, where ex-Russian sailors tend to get drunk and trash onsens and bars, thus scaring away Japanese locals and making business very difficult for shop owners.

Once in a blue moon you may spot a "No non-Japanese" sign in urban parts of Japan, but 99.9% of the time it's simply a misunderstanding and poor translation than actual racism.

They come up at places like barbershops where, if you don't speak Japanese, the barber will not be able to understand what sort of haircut you want, and would rather refuse you service than give you a haircut you didn't want. Or at antique shops, where tourists might want to buy a katana not knowing that FAA regulations prohibit the transport of weapons on flights, and want to discourage foreigners from buying things they would have to forfeit at the airport.

Since the Japanese business owners who make such signs are not proficient in English, they simply choose poorly-worded English phrases to try to convey their situation. When people discuss the problem with such signs with those owners, they almost always immediately take the signs down and apologize for the trouble they caused, or seek a more appropriate English translation.

Gaijin-activists like Debito love to clamour every time a "No Gaijin" sign is spotted, but you should be aware that such people never call the shop owners to hear the other side of the story, and never mention when problems of mistranslation are resolved.



As a Chinese, Japan will be as racist as you make it. If you come to Japan as an English teacher via a reputable sponsor, you will already have a basic set of connections, and many people you will work with will treat you as an instructor first, and a Chinese/foreigner second.

You will want to polish your Japanese though (especially keigo), because it will make it much easier for you in situations where 1) depending on your complexion, people assume you are Japanese and start talking to you as a Japanese person, and 2) people inevitably realize you are not Japanese because of your rudimentary grasp of the language, and your ability to use keigo gives them an impression you are respectful of them and their culture, overriding any assumption of "Chinese arrogance" they may have (because there are some mainland laborers here who have no real interest in Japan except to make money to send home).

If you have any amount of a Canto/British-English accent, the only racism you'll likely experience is when teachers ask you to stop pronouncing English wrong, and to say it the right way, "with an American accent".

 

[saza]

Only in Hokkaido, where ex-Russian sailors tend to get drunk and trash onsens and bars, thus scaring away Japanese locals and making business very difficult for shop owners.

Once in a blue moon you may spot a "No non-Japanese" sign in urban parts of Japan, but 99.9% of the time it's simply a misunderstanding and poor translation than actual racism.

They come up at places like barbershops where, if you don't speak Japanese, the barber will not be able to understand what sort of haircut you want, and would rather refuse you service than give you a haircut you didn't want. Or at antique shops, where tourists might want to buy a katana not knowing that FAA regulations prohibit the transport of weapons on flights, and want to discourage foreigners from buying things they would have to forfeit at the airport.

Since the Japanese business owners who make such signs are not proficient in English, they simply choose poorly-worded English phrases to try to convey their situation. When people discuss the problem with such signs with those owners, they almost always immediately take the signs down and apologize for the trouble they caused, or seek a more appropriate English translation.

Gaijin-activists like Debito love to clamour every time a "No Gaijin" sign is spotted, but you should be aware that such people never call the shop owners to hear the other side of the story, and never mention when problems of mistranslation are resolved.



As a Chinese, Japan will be as racist as you make it. If you come to Japan as an English teacher via a reputable sponsor, you will already have a basic set of connections, and many people you will work with will treat you as an instructor first, and a Chinese/foreigner second.



You will want to polish your Japanese though (especially keigo), because it will make it much easier for you in situations where 1) depending on your complexion, people assume you are Japanese and start talking to you as a Japanese person, and 2) people inevitably realize you are not Japanese because of your rudimentary grasp of the language, and your ability to use keigo gives them an impression you are respectful of them and their culture, overriding any assumption of "Chinese arrogance" they may have (because there are some mainland laborers here who have no real interest in Japan except to make money to send home).

If you have any amount of a Canto/British-English accent, the only racism you'll likely experience is when teachers ask you to stop pronouncing English wrong, and to say it the right way, "with an American accent".

Yeah, thats a good thing. I was taught Keigo for my first year in learning Japanese and also from the way you put it, it doesnt seem they are that racist if you show that you are enthusiastic about their culture and are willing to learn their language which might lead them to give you some respect and put away their presumptions.


I mean I know that the racism is not that bad now, but what about the girls there though? I hear they wont date the Chinese, is that true? Or does your explanation apply to this aspect as well? Or does that vary per person?

 

[guy]

but what about the girls there though? I hear they wont date the Chinese, is that true? Or does your explanation apply to this aspect as well? Or does that vary per person?

Obviously it varies per person, whether you have an appealing personality or characteristics, or otherwise. And it also depends on the girl: all girls will recognize that you're a foreigner (I'd say it's pretty tough to get far in a relationship without her knowing you're not Japanese), and to some girls that might not be an issue for them.

Some girls may be attracted to foreigners if they think they can offer them something (money, trips abroad, English lessons, or just something more interesting than dating a typical Japanese guy).

And some girls simply aren't interested in or can't imagine themselves being with a foreigner. Would I consider them racist? Not necessarily, many girls simply have never interacted with many foreigners to be comfortable with the idea of dating them. Or to put it differently, some girls are attracted to the "unknown", while others avoid it for the same reasons.

As many people have said in other places on the internet, Japanese girls are not mere simpletons who will "love you long time". They are as complicated as girls in any other globalized society. So the same basic rules apply: if you are a loser in your own home country, chances are you'll be a loser in Japan. You have no real inherent advantage or handicap purely because of race.

 

[RogerMoore]

Wise words "guy", I agree 100%.

If a Japanese girl dates a foreigner it speaks more about her individual character, it has nothing really to do with her being Japanese.

 

[KCRose]

Can we get a general Racism overview, I'm "African American" and I'll be heading over in a few months myself, so I could use some advice also.

 

[aquamarine]

You'll be considered to be
1) In the US Military
2) Nigerian

 

[E-raven]

I still remember how aquamarine listed how and why Japanese dont like specific foreigners. Well deserved I might say

 

[JavFanatic]

You'll be considered to be
1) In the US Military
2) Nigerian

Only idiots would jump to such stupid conclusions. There's racism in Japan like there is anywhere else.

But, most people are decent, and if you're a sound, friendly guy and you let those qualities shine through, you'll do okay over here.

 

[JavFanatic]

I still remember how aquamarine listed how and why Japanese dont like specific foreigners. Well deserved I might say

And you would be so wrong.

No group of people deserve to be disliked. Certainly, certain individuals within any group deserve our contempt, but to impugn a whole group of people because of a few individual is stupid, and racist.

 

[aquamarine]

But, most people are decent, and if you're a sound, friendly guy and you let those qualities shine through, you'll do okay over here.

That's the most flower-child-like naive thing I've seen today. Dude, just how long have you lived here???? Obviously not long enough to have seen how foreigners are really treated - and no, taking a two-week vacation doesn't count as 'living' in Japan.

 

[JavFanatic]

That's the most flower-child-like naive thing I've seen today. Dude, just how long have you lived here???? Obviously not long enough to have seen how foreigners are really treated - and no, taking a two-week vacation doesn't count as 'living' in Japan.

Been here since 2000, and I am glad my experience here is different than yours.

I've been subjected to some bullshit, but my time here has been overwhelmingly positive. I've had a great time, and made friends from different countries.

Discrimination exists everywhere, I never said Japan is a society free of racism. I just don't think it's as bad as you make it out to be.

I think if someone comes to Japan with positive expectations, and a positive attitude living here will be much easier, and enjoyable.