Form an opinion before someone forms it for you...

[techie]

Ok bear with me, this will be a bit here and there... but see if you can follow the underlying issue and let me know what YOU think.

:hero:

Here is a take on a possibility of reasoning at a government level in Japan vs. other nations, which I believe many might have not thought of. Be it because it is not the common knowledge to most people, or perhaps because it is not such a topic often discussed in direct relation with one and other.

As we all know, it is common belief that Japanese are more “promiscuous” in their relation to sexual activities. It may be true for one reason or another where one opinion states it is due to the fact it is simply regarded a need that is to be satisfied somehow, much like having breakfast or reading the newspaper in the morning.
(See another thread here on AO about that.)

On the other hand, and in direct opposition to this statement, I think even fewer know that Japan is also world leader in the extreme opposite. Japan namely have one of the highest numbers of A-sexual individuals or couples formed by A-sexual people.

A-sexual not as in abnormally sexy, even though most in here may think so, but A-sexual meaning “abstaining from the sexuality of any form” in their daily life.
This relates to statistical data on the age-group 18-30 (with reservation for my ever failing memory that could be off by a few years on the upper scale.)

Now this, in its turn gives us grounds for concern, or should I perhaps better say, gives the Japanese government grounds for serious considerations.

It is also a known fact that Japan in the next 50 years will end up in a situation where the number of retired residents needing care and benefits will heavily outweigh the younger working generation. Some say by a factor of 2:1 while others state as high figures as 3:1.

This means that with a population of a growing number of A-sexual, and thereby non reproducing, citizens, the burden on the younger generation grows with time as fewer are around to care for, or contribute to the nations continued financial burdens towards these retirees.

So, here comes another aspect of what has been discussed on AO recently.

In the light of the daunting task of increasing population growth rapidly, perhaps the Japanese government simply lets sexually implicit material go a little bit more free than other countries, simply because it part promotes reproductive activities.

The sword is always double edged in such a solution of course, such as having to contend against foreign entities and interest groups criticizing a whole nations standards and policies (see recent topic of Illusion software banning a product from sale outside Japan AND inside Japan because of US based feminists) or for example the much worse facts seen in society as a whole for many years now.

I am referring to two other extremes in Japanese society, which few speak of, and perhaps even fewer foreigners ever heard about. Namely, that younger girls are known to work for some kind of sexual service provider or another, be it as a call-girl/escort, street works, selling underwear and so forth to simply make some extra money to cover the expensive habits Japanese youth have with wanting the best, the latest and always foreign fashion products and brand name products.

Immediately following this statistical data comes the fact that Japan also have one of the highest number of abortions used as a replacement for contraceptives, and relatively easily can obtain an abortion compared to what would be possible in the US where criticism against such acts are actively fought against. Again, often by the very same people who fight against companies such as Illusion software.

As a footnote, without digressing to much, it sounds like they don’t really know what they are fighting against, so they better shoot in both directions, because one should be right apparently.

IMHO (and I will likely be flamed for this but I’m used to it), I think abortions should only be permitted for a) if the woman was r***ing and b) if there is significant risks to the health of the mother or child with going to full term, but that’s a whole different discussion.

Now, back to the issue of Japan and a slight comparison.

I am not sure regarding statistics about the r*** risk in Japan, but it was suggested r***s occur less than 1/3 as many times as vs. the US.

Then we should keep in mind that r***s have been reported according to statisticians in past years to be as highly frequent as once every 9 minutes in the US. I personally believe that is a fictional statement as it would mean in average 58,400 r***s a year.

How many of these are real and reported is a whole different mathematical game altogether, but if this is true, then Japan would have approx. 19,467 r***s per annum over a population of approx. 128 million people.

To compare this with a smaller country, Sweden (which is simple for me since you all might have figured out by now I came from there once a long time ago) an institute just completed the summary of a EU related project comparing only 11 EU nations, where Sweden is said to have 4 times as many r***s as the UK, and be absolute top leader in this case. So in this case, shouldn’t the US feminists come over and blame TPB or someone else again for that as well?

Granted, we have a few factors to take in account again. Swedish women have better support in court and tend to report r***s more than other nations women. We also have no facts on how many r***s where confirmed or convicted. Only claims unsupported by reputable evidence in a majority of cases.

So, what it all breaks down to is the following.

Empty words from screaming activists, throwing dirt in any direction for a repetitive 15 minutes of fame, founded on statistical data based on assumptions from an all nothing knowing entity in a country which is not even related to the latest case of superimposing of social ideals.

The one who said it the best was George Carlin.
To constantly project your penis into other peoples affairs has a defined name. It’s called “Fucking with them”.

And as far I can tell, that is what the US has been doing with Japan since they refused them an immigration quota (even for students) since the end of the WWII.

It is time for the US, as a nation to leave other nations to their own affairs, and to keep their own lobby organizations in their own lobby, rather than on the doorstep of other nations internal affairs.

Well then again, that is simply my personal opinion, but it surely would be interesting to hear what others think about this rant.

Is there something to it, or are all this simply matters of conjugational perceptions from an outsiders point of view? What do you think?

Elaborate, rant, educate and most importantly, form an opinion before someone form it for you.

 

[Sakunyuusha]

This thread can go in a lot of directions, but for my part I want to just focus on the question of Japan's declining birth rate for now. Maybe later I'll join in on some of the other arguments I'm sure are bound to surface. lol

Occam's razor leads us, I believe, to the two major reasons for Japan's declining birth rate. It's not a conspiracy and it's not complicated.

1. the role of women in modern Japan
2. the means by which men procure sexual pleasure in modern Japan

Women: this one is little different from what we see in "democratized" nations which were previously male-dominated societies (and to some extent may still be, just not as great an extent as before "democracy" showed up). In the 1980s, but also in the decades leading up to this time period, Japanese women became more independent from Japanese men. With respect to:

• owning property,
• raising a family,
• working (blue- or white-collar work)
• civil rights,

and much more, Japanese women found themselves closer to being social equals to Japanese men than they had been in over 1,100 years. What this should mean for society is, I hope, fairly obvious:
(1) women who only married because they had to, now no longer marry because they no longer have to
(2) no marriage --> no kids

(3) advancements in medical contraception allowed women to partake in recreational sex without the risk of becoming pregnant despite one's plans for the future [which, often times, cannot co-exist with being pregnant or being a mother]. This meant that women could now choose between sex w/ baby-making or sex w/o baby-making, whereas before they had to choose between sex w/ baby-making or else no sex at all. Conclusion? Duh: the easier it is to have sex without having kids, the more likely the birth rate is to decline -- because people are hard-wired to want to fuck but are also sapient enough to recognize that children are, more often than not, an unwanted burden during their lives. Such is the selfish nature of life: because parenthood requires you give everything up for the child, and humans are da~amned selfish creatures!

Men: up until the Meiji period, the Japanese man had few sexual outs. He could fuck his wife. He could fuck other men's wives. He could fuck prostitutes. Or he could fuck his (male) kohai or his disciples, depending on his social status. The only one which was completely devoid of the risk of impregnating his sex partner was the boy/man-fucking, but as you can imagine (a) most men didn't have access to this and (b) even those who did often times were not keen to have sex with boys/men. Again, because of the human sex drive, what this meant for Japanese men was that, more often than not, they were going to wind up fucking some woman and, playing the odds, fathering some child or children before they themselves died.

Fast forward to modern-day Japan. Here are just a few of the problems confronting sexual reproduction from the male side of the equation:

• NEETs, by their nature, are all but removed from sexual reproduction
• poor men, homeless men, etc. may only have access to fucking hookers. But (as mentioned previously) hookers now have excellent contraceptives, generally provided to them by their pimps, so whereas before in the 1730s these men might have fathered street urchins, today these men father nobody.
• marriage used to come to men pretty easy, because women had to marry. Now that the women don't have to if they don't want to, Japanese men have to work harder to find a spouse. In turn, this means that they're less likely to father children -- A, because they're not yet married so they can't father children with their wife 'cause they haven't got a wife; and B because they don't want to father children outside of wedlock because they know that if they do that will scare away potential wives, i.e. no single woman in her late 20s is going to want to marry a man in his early 30s who has fathered three kids. So it's in the men's interest, too, for the purposes of trying to market themselves to get a wife more easily that they have to use condoms and such in order to prevent themselves from becoming fathers prematurely.
• the Japanese porn industry is one of the most famous in the world. It should come as no surprise to anybody that most users of pornography use it by themselves. Furthermore, porn by its nature gratifies most of its users' sexual needs, and therefore keeps those men single who would otherwise have gotten married only because of their strong primal urge to fuck.
• And then never mind porn: what about sex toys? As I mentioned in another thread, there are testimonials from clients on Tenga's corporate website which say things like "The OnaCup feels better than any vagina I've ever fucked" or "Your product feels 10x better than my wife's vagina does!", etc. When you invent a sex toy that feels better than the real thing, that's BOUND to have some negative repercussions on the rate of childbirths in your country.

So ... I think these are the main reasons for why Japan's childbirth rate has declined so much. It's not primarily because Westerners have brainwashed the Japanese into believing that they're a horny people and so the Japanese have reactionarily become prudes to try and shed that negative image. I don't think that's the case at all, to be perfectly honest. I think women are making less babies because they're with men less and they use contraceptives more, and men are making babies less because they're with women less and the women they are with use contraceptives more.

 

[Ceewan]

thats a lot of reading

This seems to be a fairly open topic.

Now I would prefer this not be taken the wrong way, everyone is entitled to their own opinion after all, but sometimes US bashing gets a little old. The US is a large and diverse nation. No one group, be it political, religious, educational, or philosophical, represents the sentiments of all its citizens. Nor can any other nation on earth be said to have been more helpful in suppling aid, charity, and various types of support to their fellow nations. This being said perhaps no other nation has shown such a willing desire to try to influence other nations in the area of human rights. I do not agree with everything the US does in these areas but if one tries, if one makes the attempt, they will find many examples they can admire. Just my opinion of course. The line between meddlesome and helpful is one of perspective afterall.

I'm not crazy about abortion either, it "feels" wrong, killing a seed before it can grow. I am not a fanatic on this subject, people have a right to make their own choices.

Interesting input on sex in Japan but I have only strong feelings on one point;
I don't care how good a sex toy is it can't beat a soft warm body that is reactive and considerate to your desires. A toy can't love you, need you, or adore you. It does not have the ability to want you and only you. It can offer only moments of pleasure. There is nothing wrong with that but there is no comparison between the two.

I enjoyed reading this and hopefully there will be more interesting tidbits and observations in this thread to enjoy later.

 

[techie]

I'm happy the issue is not being taken as a flaming one but grounds for diverse discussion.
As such I think diverse discussion in any given direction is the only true way by which a general and global understanding of others and (perhaps) improvement of ones own opinions and formation of respect for others opinions can be formed.

On the issue of US being pro human rights, I am personally a bit baffled since the US signed the human rights agenda, but it seems still to be needed ratification in the actual daily life.

Take for example the fact that the US to date holds some 3 million (3,000,000) individuals in various level prisons pending deportation for violation overstay laws. In my opinion they should simply a) make good on kicking them out or b) let them go to work already. The mathematical concept o benefit to the society as a whole, rather than putting more strain on tax payer funds is or should be obvious to even a layman in Macro economics.

I spent quite a lot of time in the US to find out that from all the people I met, there was one I could speak openly with who opposed many things where human rights where concerned.

There are many examples but they digress to far from the thread in themselves I believe.

What I meant with the topic as an undertone was "Is it right for foreigners not knowing squat about the issues in one nation, to criticize such a nations nationals to the extent they should comply to the critics own social format?"

Hence the Illusion software connection where one nations ideals overshadows an others current status. Of course this could be taken to extremes, like someone said a long time ago, that the solution to the problems in Afghanistan would be to give them free satellite TV to turn them too, into couch potatoes lacking no commercial input.

I doubt it is the essence of the whole solution needed, as I told one friend from Sudan.

"The only way to ensure freedom and peace is very simply the following.
He who has food on the table, a job and at least basic education will understand that fighting only leads to the enhanced risk to loose everything you have gained. Thus fighting will, if not end, at least be the less desired option. An in particular if he has a job, he doesn't have time to fight."

And you can quote me on that, having seen it first hand too.